Relational Teaching and the Power of Motivation with Karyn Brown

What does it mean to teach relationally? For Karyn Brown, assistant dean of communication and media at Mississippi State University and a Grisham Master Level Teacher, the answer begins with a simple conviction she's carried since her first day in the classroom: you cannot be an effective teacher without first building genuine relationships with your students.

In this episode — the very first of InCITEful Teaching — host Dr. Shannon Harmon sits down with the professor who first inspired her own teaching, in a conversation that is part reunion, part reflection, and entirely about what it looks like to see, know, and motivate the students in front of you. Karyn shares how she approaches the classroom as a community, why "warm and demanding" isn't a contradiction, and what she's observed about student motivation across more than two decades of teaching.

If you've ever wondered how to help students care more deeply about learning, or how small moments of connection can change the trajectory of a semester, this conversation is for you.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

It started when I was thrown into this classroom and I didn't know how to teach. And I think a lot of people in academia are in that same boat. And I thought to myself, what did I cherish about teachers I had had? What did mentors I've had in my past do? And it really boiled down to every single one of them, took time with me, invested in me, and had a relationship with me.

SPEAKER_01 0:28

Welcome to Insightful Teaching, the podcast from the Center for Innovation and Teaching Excellence at Mississippi State University. I'm your host, Dr. Shannon Harman, and I am so glad you're here. Whether you're listening on your drive to campus, between meetings, or maybe even while sipping your coffee, welcome. This podcast was created for you, faculty and staff who care deeply about teaching, learning, and the student experience at Mississippi State and beyond. This podcast is a space for real conversations about teaching and learning, what's working, what's challenging, and what's changing in higher education. Together, we'll explore innovative teaching strategies, connect practice to research, and most importantly, we'll amplify the voices of faculty and staff who are doing incredible work every day. So whether you're a brand new instructor or a seasoned professor, our hope is that every episode leaves you with at least one idea you can take back to your classroom or one perspective that helps you see your work in a new way. And I honestly cannot imagine a more meaningful way to launch this podcast than with today's episode. Our very first conversation is centered on relational teaching and the power of motivation. The idea that learning is deeply connected to connection, to trust, to belonging, and to students feeling seen and valued in our classrooms, which is exactly how I felt when I was an undergrad here at Mississippi State. So it is my honor to introduce today's guest, the assistant dean of communication and media in the College of Arts and Sciences, a Grisham master level teacher here at Mississippi State, the person who first imagined this podcast into existence. And in a very heartfelt full circle moment for me, she was my very own professor when I was an undergraduate here at State. So I just want to welcome Karen Brown. Karen, thank you so much for being here.

SPEAKER_00 2:28

Thank you. And like you said, full circle moment. I am thrilled to be here. I'm thrilled you're doing this podcast. And I love when we have students in our class and we don't hear from them for a while. And then 25 years in 2025. But to be able to see the growth and what you're doing, um, I'm truly impressed, Shannon. So thank you. Thank you for having me. I'm excited to talk today.

SPEAKER_01 2:53

I honestly could not have imagined a better person to have. And it's just an honor for me for you to be my first guest. Thank you so much. So tell us a little bit, um, as we said, it's been 25 years since we've really even seen each other. Um and so I've done lots of things and become this professor in higher education. Um, tell us a little bit about your journey, Karen, and what you've been doing in this time.

SPEAKER_00 3:16

So, really, my first job, I thought it would be good to start talking about this. I didn't intend to be a teacher. It really was circumstance that I needed a graduate assistantship. And so I jumped into teaching. And then when we came to Mississippi State 20 um 33 years ago, we were going to be here two years and get the heck out of the small little town. So started teaching in the communication department, teaching public speaking, but I had a broadcast background. And so I really wanted to give back to all the mentors that I had in that field to my be that for my students. And so I started teaching broadcasting, public relations, jumped to our capstone classes in both broadcasting and PR. I have a split degree, which I thought at the time was kind of crazy, but now I'm thrilled that I did because they relate and intersect so much. So it's been a blessing. And then in 2014, the dean's office was looking for somebody to help with their communication. And I started with one course release, helping with a newsletter that developed into two-course release, three-course release, and now I'm full-time administration. So um I my heart misses teaching in the classroom, but I do have interns and I love the one-on-one teaching. I think in so many circumstances, teaching isn't just standing in before a class, it comes in all different shapes and sizes.

SPEAKER_01 4:37

Absolutely. And I remember vividly that we had class in the Y Center. Yes. And so we were doing and enacting the things that you were teaching me, and that was so powerful. Um, like you said, I also didn't um set out to be a teacher. As you know, I was in broadcast journalism. Um, that's my degree here from this amazing university, broadcast journalism and public relations. But in my work as being a classroom K-12 teacher and then a teacher of higher ed, like you said, I use the intersection of communications and um what I'm doing in the classroom and teaching is just it's there all the time, every day. Um, and even in this podcast, right? Bringing it all together. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 5:16

We all teach. Absolutely, yes. We all teach, and so we do it in a more formal setting. Right.

SPEAKER_01 5:22

Yeah. And I think that's so important. We teach and we mentor um in in so many various ways. So it's my hope that this podcast allows everyone to see and to gain some new um insight about teaching and learning. Yes. This episode is more than just a conversation for me, um, it's a story about your mentorship, your impact, um, but also just how teaching echoes across time. Um, today I hope to talk a little bit about relational teaching, what that really looks like in practice. And then within that, motivation, uh, because once you are really engaged in this relational teaching, your students feel more motivated. We want to talk about small moments of connection and also just how learning has changed across generations of learners. Learners. So if you are listening today and you've ever wondered how to help students care more deeply about learning or how to build stronger connections in your classroom, this conversation is for you. And let's go back to what you said briefly, Karen, about relational. To me, uh, that actually really resonates with me and my philosophy of teaching, which is really anchored in Vygotsky's work. Constructivism is really about creating and constructing your own meaning. And that happens when the teacher acts as this facilitator of learner learning and really engages with their learners. Um, that's a little bit about my philosophy. So it gives you a hint of what I then do in the classroom. So that's my um way of thinking about this idea of relational teaching. But how does that relational teaching, what does that mean for you and what does it look like in your classroom?

SPEAKER_00 7:02

I would have to say, since I started teaching, I can't imagine being able to teach without having that relationship. And it started when I was thrown into this classroom and I didn't know how to teach. And I think a lot of people in academia are in that same boat. They haven't been taught how to teach. Absolutely. So I didn't know how to teach. And I thought to myself, what did I cherish about teachers I had had? What did mentors I've had in my past do? And it really boiled down to every single one of them, took time with me, invested in me, and had a relationship with me. And I think it's a complex relationship. In many ways, when I became a parent, I realized it's really close to parenting because sometimes you have to be hard on your students. Sometimes they break your heart, you know, and other times you have a really good time with them. But I honestly don't believe you can be as an effective teacher if you don't build those relationships. Now that can be hard in a whole classroom, but I've learned early on that every classroom created its, became its own community.

SPEAKER_01 8:12

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 8:13

Its own dynamic dynamic based on who was in the class. So I kind of treated it as its own little family. And then there were some people in the family that were more extrovert, more introvert. Some you had to pull out, some were having problems. I think it's what we do with friends and family every day. We just did it in a more formal setting in a classroom.

SPEAKER_01 8:33

Yeah, I too love this idea of a community of learners. And the professor or teacher in that classroom is part of that community of learners. They're not just the giver of what the learners learn. It is really a community of learners. And then this idea of knowing who each other is, the context of those learners, where they're coming from, that's so powerful in building this relational, this idea of relational teaching.

SPEAKER_00 8:55

Absolutely. And you have to be a part of it. When you just said that, it reminded me the day 9-11 happened. And I was teaching broadcast performance. And I thought, well, how are they dealing with this? But at the same time, you're kind of dealing with this complex emotion yourself. But I thought, experience it with the students. So we brought in three different TVs, um, one that were just three networks, you know, for it is, and and listen and watch what they did and experience it with them. So I think that's really important.

SPEAKER_01 9:26

Oh, that's so authentic. And being vulnerable like that with your students, I think actually only makes it more powerful of what you teach them later.

SPEAKER_00 9:34

I agree. Yeah, I agree.

SPEAKER_01 9:35

Yeah. So you said that sometimes um when you're building that relational teaching, that means you have to be tough on students. Yes, that's hard. It is hard. And it had it's hard to be the receiver of that being tough, which is, you know, the great story about us, Karen.

SPEAKER_00 9:52

Yes, yes. We need to fill everybody in.

SPEAKER_01 9:55

So I was not the most dedicated of students as an undergrad. I was a first gen, uh, I went two two years to community college, and then I paid for my two years here, and I really enjoyed it. I got my money's worth. It was wonderful. And however, I didn't always go to class. And you called me one day on my home phone, my landline. Um at my when we had those. Again, 25 years ago, folks. Uh, a long time ago, and you called me, and um, you said, Shannon, if you don't get to class, I'm going to fail you. And uh with shaking hands, I hung up the phone and I came to class every day.

SPEAKER_00 10:37

You didn't curse me.

SPEAKER_01 10:39

I was too scared. Um, but Karen, you were the first person in my life who saw this potential in me to be more than what I saw for myself. And so that has stuck with me forever. And I didn't know to call that relational teaching and relational mentorship, but that's exactly what it was.

SPEAKER_00 10:59

No, you're so, you know, when I think back to, you know, we talked about this. I don't remember the phone call, but then again, I'm approaching 16 years. So, but you know, the impact that it made on you, um, I saw so much potential. And that's the job of a teacher is to see that potential in every student and in different ways. And I think sometimes students think we just want to, we're out to get them. And they don't realize that I can remember one night I was awake all night long because I was gonna have to fail somebody. And it broke my heart. And I think they, you know, the student thinks at the time, but I couldn't let that person go out into the world. My husband talks about this all the time. He teaches broadcast or he teaches meteorology for the program here. And I say, when you have to fail a student, and he said, I can't put that person in front of an audience when they could have an impact on their life if they have the wrong forecast. So that's the way I approach it too is what does this student need to be able to be successful in their future?

SPEAKER_01 12:06

Right. And it is our hope and intent that one day they will be sitting across from you years later and say, Thank you for doing that for me. I needed someone to encourage me. I didn't have that in my life anywhere else. And so I needed that. Um, you know, the other beautiful story, uh part of that story is that later that same semester, you pushed me to write a campaign for the Census 2000 for a PSA, and we won an award, and we got to go to Jackson together. And those are just moments, again, I had never won an award. I had, you know, not been to an award ceremony in Jackson. And so it was things like that that you just really were the first person to do that for me. And my career, looking back on it, it really started right in that moment. So thank you so much.

SPEAKER_00 12:46

Well, and I think for everybody listening, that's why you teach. I mean, we're not in it for loads of money and making a fortune, but hearing you say that means absolutely the world. And I think that's a really important lesson for new teachers as well, because we do these things, and it may be 25 years later when you hear the impact, but we do it anyway because we know it's going to be there. And I think some of the lessons students learn aren't until they leave the university.

SPEAKER_01 13:15

Absolutely. Yeah, until looking back. No, I truly believe the teacher has the biggest impact on changing a student's life and being that difference maker. And I do also firmly believe that that's not always, you know, roses and compliments all the time. That is also saying what you're doing well and how we're going to do it, do it better together, or what you're doing well and what you still need to work on and how we're going to do that together. And again, that comes back to building that community of learners.

SPEAKER_00 13:41

I think about broadcasting, but I think this applies in anything that you teach. Um, one day I could tell the timing of the show was gonna be off, and our TA was wanting to stop them before they got there. And I said, No, let the train wreck happen. And sure enough, they looked at me and they said, What happened? And I said, What just happened? You tell me. And so we were there another hour and a half, they were frustrated. I was frustrated, but I guarantee they will never miss time a show after that. They never did.

SPEAKER_01 14:11

No, failing forward, yes, and learning from it. It's how you react, right? Because we're humans and life is not perfect. It is what we do after. Yes, absolutely. Yeah, absolutely. I wonder, I love that. I love that. Um, so let's go back to this idea of I wasn't motivated to come class, come to class. So you kind of um gave me a swift kick through a phone call. Yeah, there was no physical damage. Yeah. Um, so again, this seeing this, putting this motivation in me, lighting this fire. Um, students in research, it tells us, uh, I think Nell Noddings is the is the researcher who's really done a lot of work in um students feeling seen. And when they feel seen or valued in a classroom, they are more motivated to come and to learn and then to engage in their learning. Um and by come to class, I also mean like if it's in an online setting, whatever it is, opt-in. Students want to opt in, they're motivated to opt in. So I'm wondering, um, in the 25 years since you've taught me, um, through all the trauma that's gone on, you said 9-11, we've had COVID. How has motivation for students to opt into learning changed over time? What have you seen?

SPEAKER_00 15:24

So that's a really good question and a hard one. I definitely see students are so different than they were 25 years ago. And that motivation has continuously gone down. I have found more than any other time in my teaching career the importance of showing them how what you're teaching is actually used in the real world.

SPEAKER_01 15:47

Yes, I agree. You know, that explicit here's the skill that you need that directly links to this um career. Yes. Um, I think is so important for students to see and know. Um, sometimes even more so than memorizing or learning all of the vocabulary, right? It's how you are then using um what you're learning.

SPEAKER_00 16:07

And I find too, one thing that I I don't know, maybe I do it too much. I use a lot of examples in class from my own job. And I remember one class, it was so funny. I said something about, well, don't do this. And they said, How did you keep your job? And I said, I know, right? Um, but those that taught me, do you have a rain plan when you have an event outside? Yes. I mean, why didn't I have a rain plan? But all these little mistakes, but you can learn from them, or here's some of my successes. But I think when they can hear how this really worked in the real world and it makes it more meaningful to them, they're more motivated to learn.

SPEAKER_01 16:42

Yeah, I agree. And I think what you just said, so again, it goes back to this relational teaching, right? Yes. If you're vulnerable about how you have failed forward and what you've done as a result, then your students are like, oh, yeah, I can relate. Yeah. Um, and so that then motivates them to do something. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 16:59

No, and the really, you know, I thought a lot about when you mentioned the relational part of teaching and why why do I approach teaching like that? And I think number one, it's the white reason I'm here today because teachers did that for me. But also too, Mezzl's hierarchy of needs. We we have a sense of wanting to belong to something and to have that teacher be able to say Shannon, or even in a large lecture section where you can't get to know all your students, be able to say, tell me your name again, or you know, just bringing them in, just having somebody call your name. I think I that was one thing I really tried to master was names and calling people by their names.

SPEAKER_01 17:40

I did too. And I taught for the bulk of my career at Middle Tennessee State University for 13 years in elementary education. And I also made it uh a habit and I taught a 4-4, so 12 hours each semester to know every student by name.

SPEAKER_00 17:56

That's important.

SPEAKER_01 17:56

Um now my class sizes usually were capped at 24. So I've often thought about my colleagues, especially on this campus who are teaching those three and four hundred uh folks, you know, classes, lecture classes. Yeah. Any what do you think we should, what advice could we give them?

SPEAKER_00 18:13

No, I think be creative. You know, I I think what I would do, if I were teaching a large lecture section right now, I would have every day a certain number of students that I would single out that I'm gonna ask them questions just so I could call them by name. Or I've even just done looking through the role, you know, and and say, Joe, where's Joe? You know, just to pull him out because if you know somebody's gonna call on you that somebody really cares, it makes you want to listen more. I this I found interesting. I was thinking about our talk. Relationships reduce discipline issues, and care isn't about being warm and fuzzy. I think this is an important point. I'm a warm and fuzzy, very um empathic person, but I don't think that is required for every single teacher. I think you can train yourself to be, you know, have empathy.

SPEAKER_01 19:06

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 19:07

Um, do you do you agree? Some people just say, well, I'm just um you're either empathetic or you're not.

SPEAKER_01 19:11

No, I totally agree. Um, my students at MTSU had a joke. They created t-shirts and they were hashtag high expectation, Dr. Horman's class. Um just because I expected them, you know, to do the right things. It's not that I had these high expectations. It's just that I had some expectations. Um, and actually, I was not like I yelled at them and said, you better do this. It was just, it was what you said. It's like I was a warm demander, right? You'll warmly expressing, here's how what I want you to do. And if you don't, we'll talk about it and we're gonna, you know, get there. Um, so yeah, I think it doesn't always have to be like, you know, best friends and hug your students every day. Exactly. Right? It's more about, you know, one of the things I like to do is I like to stand at the door before class and just say, hey, good morning, good afternoon, how are you? Even if I couldn't remember everybody's name, you know, I knew they were supposed to be in there. Yeah. Um, and so that I think that's something different too. Um, when students, especially in a world today where we're looking at our phones or we're not making eye contact or we're not having those interactions human to human. I think it's so important just to even acknowledge students' presence.

SPEAKER_00 20:17

Absolutely. And when you do that, um, this is an example that I thought of too for sharing. You can notice when something's off. And I had one guy in class and I thought, something's just off. He's just not nonverbally the same as he had been. And so I just sent an email, said, just wanted to check on you. I've just noticed. And he told me about how his girlfriend had broke up with him. And I mean, that's tough when you're that age.

SPEAKER_01 20:40

Absolutely. And you might have been the only person who even acknowledged that for that student. And so, how amazing. You know, just that little small minute of, hey, what's going on? Are you okay? That could really change the projection of someone's whole day and maybe even semester.

SPEAKER_00 20:56

Absolutely. And so I don't know what to say. I know sometimes there's teachers who say, Well, I shouldn't have to do that. To me, it's just part of teaching. It's it's part of being a teacher.

SPEAKER_01 21:05

It is, it is part of being a relational teacher. Relational teacher. And again, all of those things decrease. So students come to class. You don't have then students not coming to class. If they come to class, oh, then they're more likely to be successful.

SPEAKER_00 21:17

Right.

SPEAKER_01 21:17

So think about the positive ripple something that small has the potential, you know, to change for a student.

SPEAKER_00 21:24

I would say my entire trajectory of my job being here today was one teacher after class. It was speech. And I left, this was freshman year of high school. And she said to me, Have you ever thought about being on the speech team? You did a really nice job. And boy, was that like, oh my gosh, somebody recognized. Because I thought, I don't have any skills. I'm not a cheerleader, I'm not an athlete. You know, what am I gonna do? And then when she noticed that, I thought, I'm gonna start doing that when I started teaching, trying to point out things that I notice in students. Have you thought about this? Because, man, you'd be a great producer.

SPEAKER_01 22:00

Which is exactly what Barbara Daughtery saw in me when I was so fast forward from my experience with you. And I was doing a professional development training one summer. And a professor said, Hey, can you stay back? I'd like to talk to you. And of course I thought I was in trouble because my other teachers, you know. Um, and so she said, Do you want to come full time and be a grad student? And I'll pay your, you know, your um stipend and I'll and I'll pay for your school if you'll come and work for me full time. And so that's how I got my master's. And then she's amazing, you know, saw something in me that said, Can you stay and I'll finish, you know, pay for your doctorate. Um, and so again, it's just noticing something, one little thing in someone that really changes uh their whole life experience. And again, that started with you doing that for me. Um, but I just I just don't know that we sometimes say that explicitly as colleagues, you know, the power that we have um on students' lives and to change them and change them for the better, hopefully.

SPEAKER_00 22:58

Yeah. And what I mean, what job can you have that has that gift, right? Knowing that you have changed somebody's life.

SPEAKER_01 23:06

Well, I think too, you know, um, I was just telling my dean this as well. I think I really thrive now in situations where uh my bosses, my leaders, let me be me. Yes, you know, and so that's what you all did for me. Um, my teachers, you guys kind of let me be me. Because even when you called me at home and said, Shannon, get here. You didn't say, Shannon, do this, this, and this. Just come.

SPEAKER_00 23:30

Well, and I could have just failed you. You know what I'm saying? Like that's the relationship part is yeah, you could just fail a student, but but why? Let's find out why they're not there and you want them there to succeed.

SPEAKER_01 23:43

And let's just say it right now for the record. I made an A in both of your classes. Yes. Just let the record show. Yes. I can't say that for my other classes here on this campus, especially the ones I took in the summer. Um, but yeah, I I was really special moment. Right. Yeah. And again, it stuck with me for forever. So I'm wondering, Karen, what advice would you give someone who just doesn't see themselves as a relational teacher?

SPEAKER_00 24:10

So I hear that often, and they might say, well, you're just more warm and fuzzy. And I don't think it's just that I'm more warm and fuzzy. Or here's one they say too: um, like I'm not bubbly, I'm not emotionally expressive. You don't have to be to be an effective teacher. And I think the relational strategies that you talked about are what we need to focus on and not being bubbly and, you know, some people are just very dry sense of humor. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 24:39

I mean, I think too, it just starts with this idea of just being aware. Oh, yes, absolutely. So being a teacher that's aware, right? Just having that awareness. And I think that's important now in our world on college campuses to just be aware of how our students are moving about, coming to class or being in class.

SPEAKER_00 24:57

Supportive language. I think just the way you talk with people. So it doesn't have to be a type of teacher that is just very extrovert. I think you can be an introvert. I think you can be quiet, but I think it can still be meaningful. Um, one thing that I've done as a teacher, so in that relationship, small moments matter. Absolutely. Um, one thing that I I don't recommend every teacher doing this, but I started having the end of the semester students come to my my um house.

SPEAKER_01 25:28

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_00 25:28

Just for an end-of-the-year celebration. And one thing that all the students would say is, it's so nice to be in a house. And I thought to myself, they're in apartments, they're in dorms. So just a little thing that I can do for them that is extra. The other thing I think about all the time is what I would want a teacher to do for my own child. Oh yeah. And I did that before I even had children. So I definitely think these are learned skills all teachers can have. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 25:56

Yeah, there is a plethora of books that I'm thinking about in my head right now when you say that, for people to read and think of and to gain those skills. But one that I also that triggered um my thinking when you said it's just small moments is Small Teaching by James Lang. Um, it's a great, quick, easy read. And then there's also small teaching online. So if you're teaching online, so there are some great powerful um things that you can do to that make a big, a big change in your classroom that also help your students feel seen and really boost your relationships with them.

SPEAKER_00 26:28

So you talked about children, you know, students being seen. Students feel known and recognized by their teachers as individuals, correlates with better academic outcomes, engagement, social emotional development. I mean, this is what you teach, Shannon. Yes. And so you see it all the time, but it makes a huge difference in the classroom.

SPEAKER_01 26:47

Well, I see, um, or I saw in my previous role at MTSU, um, I would model that behavior for my future elementary educators. And then I would see them, because I would go out to the elementary school with them and watch them teach and see them do that for third graders or to do that for fifth graders. And what if we did that in every profession? Absolutely. Right?

SPEAKER_00 27:08

Yeah, in the workplace. Absolutely. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 27:11

Right. And we do that with our colleagues, whether we're, I don't know, in manufacturing or agriculture or wherever, it doesn't have to be just in these, as you keep saying, warm and fuzzy elementary education spaces.

SPEAKER_00 27:22

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 27:22

Yeah, it can cross different disciplines and spaces.

SPEAKER_00 27:26

Or even um, you know, complimenting a student. Or I had one student and she wouldn't mind me sharing this in the podcast. She had a tea a sweatshirt, and I was like, I have got to get that sweatshirt. And it said um nap queen. And I was like, I love naps. But just having that conversation again talks to what you've mentioned before about making yourself human, approachable. And that's something I think every student should get from you as a teacher is that if they have a question, you are there for them. Right.

SPEAKER_01 27:58

And you know, one small way that we can give advice for anyone struggling to do this is on those first few days of class.

SPEAKER_00 28:05

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 28:06

Um, you know, having some kind of uh, you don't have to tell them about your whole personal life, but here's who I am, here's where I came from, here's my cat or dog, this is what I like to do in my free time. Yes. That will resonate with students more so than we think. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 28:20

I think that's a yeah, you're the name of your dog, the type of dog you have. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 28:25

Cause then you'll have, I mean, I used to do this as a joke. Okay, who likes cats, who likes dogs? Your grade depends on what you answer and how you answer. Um, and so as a joke, right? But that was just a way because that, and then I always find, you know, students they have animals, many of them are foodies, they like to travel, and then there's music. And so there's these commonalities that cross um all humans, things that we all like to do, right? And so talking about those things and sharing what your likes are will then allow your students to see the human within you.

SPEAKER_00 28:57

And there's human. There's plenty of time to do that, like you said, right before class starts or right at the end of class. So Right. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:04

I have some colleagues who um would find out their students' favorite music. And then at the start of each class, songs from those musicians would be playing as students came into class.

SPEAKER_00 29:14

I love that.

SPEAKER_01 29:15

And I thought that was beautiful.

SPEAKER_00 29:17

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 29:18

Right? Like how amazing was she, you know, to do that for them and and then honor each person's interest um each class session.

SPEAKER_00 29:26

Well, you'll laugh at this one thing I did in maybe I go, maybe I go overboard, maybe I don't, but I always used to say the students were like the horses at the Kentucky Derby because they kept wanting to jump to this next thing. And I said, you know, those horses are like wanting to jump out. Well, the day that we could get to that part, I said, the gates are open. And I I had Kentucky, what I made fake mint juleps. Oh, nice. Yeah, just to like cranberry or like what great um ginger ale and mint. But they just got the biggest kick out of that little thing. And I was like, that took me no time at all. Right. Just to get little fancy cups and saying, we're at the Kentucky Derby today. Yeah. Little thing, but they loved it.

SPEAKER_01 30:05

They loved it. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, that's great. And again, we might not be able to buy all of our students in a 300-section class, but we can show pictures, we can do case um scenarios, we can show videos. Again, we can share music, interest, and those things. I just, you know, I can hear in my head um colleagues saying, Well, I don't have time to do that. I don't have time to do that. But if you take five minutes to do something like that, the power of then students to opt in and the motivation to learn dramatically increases.

SPEAKER_00 30:36

Absolutely. And I love that you said that because that's exactly what I hear is well, it's different in this class or you have this. It's pivot, adaptability. You can adapt in those big classes. Like you said, just show the opening gates and the horses bursting out. Right. And that's how you start your lecture. You could do that in a big class. Um, I just think you can adapt.

SPEAKER_01 30:57

Absolutely. Yeah. You know, and all that research about how learners learn and just the science of learning. We learn best from people that we feel connected to.

SPEAKER_00 31:05

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 31:06

Right. Yeah. And if you feel connected via a song or the Kentucky Derby or a mint julep, right? Like whatever, however, that connection happens, it just, it's, it can be super powerful.

SPEAKER_00 31:20

One thing I used to do too, that I think you could do in any large lecture section is we talk a lot about the problem with typos and grammar errors in public relations. So I started calling them finding them in the wild. Oh, yeah. And so they would send them to me through email. And so everybody would be so excited at the first of every class because they'd be wondering, are they gonna is she gonna pull mine? And so you could do that with a class of 500. Yeah, absolutely. This one was sent to me. This was in Starkville. Yeah, you know, so you can just adapt, adapt.

SPEAKER_01 31:53

Adapt. One of my favorite things to do like that in a larger class is to do a quick um, you know, I call it an exit ticket. Like, what are you walking away with today? Um, that's something so that I can then make that connection. I sometimes have them put their names on it, and then I will write back. I have them do this just on an index card. And then I will write back and say, you know, I thought about that too. And here's how we can, you know, navigate back to what my goal for the lesson was, or thank you for telling me that. I didn't realize that came out today. We're gonna talk about that in another lesson, you know, and just to have that exchange with students in a larger class that feels personal to them, right? And just taking a few minutes to kind of acknowledge what they're walking away with.

SPEAKER_00 32:32

If I have time, I one other thing, you know, we talked about it can help discipline issues. Yes. And I don't think we have as much of that in a college classroom. But one example is I had one young man that just kept speaking out. And so finally he said, This is silly. And I said, Well, what do you think would be a better idea? Oh, yeah. And so I pulled it out and he goes, We should have boys against girls in this frame. And I said, Let's do it. Do it, let's do it. I love that. And you know what? Game changer for him. Uh-huh. Just yeah.

SPEAKER_01 32:59

Because you honored his thought. I did, yeah. Yeah, and his choice, and you gave him some voice and choice to then is just like that's a huge powerful moment.

SPEAKER_00 33:07

Yeah. Yeah. Or a student that thinks, I know too much, you know, I don't need this. I have pulled them in and said, I'm so glad we've got somebody in this class that actually has done this. You did an internship. And then they can be the voice. So I think again, connecting with them makes them feel yeah.

SPEAKER_01 33:25

Well, again, just because you're the teacher of record on the, you know, on the class doesn't necessarily mean that you have all the information. Exactly. Especially in the world today, our learners are not just typical generate, you know, first generation students, right? We have a lot of adult learners. We have learners who have um, you know, full-time jobs while they're learning. They have a lot of experience.

SPEAKER_00 33:44

Yeah. And let's pull on that experience.

SPEAKER_01 33:46

Absolutely. Let's utilize them to help teach the class. How amazing is that? Now we've got to recognize them. We've got to know that they can contribute, right? In the right way. So, but honoring them, that's very powerful. Um, and giving them skills, you know, like I said, to teach their, to teach their their peers and and to be collaborative in their learning.

SPEAKER_00 34:09

Yeah. Who doesn't want to be made to feel important and heard and seen? Yeah. And seen. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 34:17

Thank you. Um, okay. So we've talked a lot about uh relationships and building those relationships, which then equates to motivation.

SPEAKER_00 34:25

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 34:26

So if you were giving uh a faculty member on this campus or beyond some advice, one piece of advice that they could then take back to their classroom next semester or next week or tomorrow, what would you give them?

SPEAKER_00 34:39

Is does it have to be just one or can it be multiple? You go for it.

SPEAKER_01 34:42

We'll take one or 12. We'll take them all.

SPEAKER_00 34:46

I think one of the things we talked about at the very beginning is to get be a part of that community, to get to know them. I love what you said about meeting them at the door. I would just get there early, just talk with them. Um, and then the other thing I would do is real life examples of how this work is going to be something they will use. That those would be my my top three.

SPEAKER_01 35:10

Yeah, I think that's great. I mean, I think even just doing one of those things could really change the dynamic of your classroom. And so I would urge our listeners to do that, to think about one thing that they could go and do if it is just standing at the door or making a connection in their lesson or lecture for the day to the real world and to what's applicable for that profession, I think would be huge and change the trajectory of their semester as well.

SPEAKER_00 35:36

Absolutely, absolutely. And then even just bringing in current events. Oh god, everybody's gonna kill me for saying this, but you know, the whole six, seven thing. You know, we were at orientation and I think just saying, you know, six, seven, and when they see you as a human, it makes such a difference.

SPEAKER_01 35:52

Right. Yeah. Or even um things in the community. I had a a professor recently talk about uh in front of students talking about just connections. Here's where you go to do this. Yeah, you know, the best cheese fries are here. And the learners were like, whoa, my professor's kind of cool. They know where things are.

SPEAKER_00 36:09

They go outside the walls of this room. Right.

SPEAKER_01 36:13

Yeah, absolutely. Just I that's so great. Seeing each other as humans and people first.

SPEAKER_00 36:18

Yes, absolutely. And then I think when you do that, when there is an issue, you're approachable. And that would be my other piece of advice. I hear students all the time scared to talk to their teachers. I want, I think every teacher should strive to be approachable. Now, being approachable does not mean you're a pushover. It doesn't mean that you're giving grades, but I'm a hundred percent confident that you can, and I've done this, having to send somebody down and saying, You I remember one paper, I um the students got a 20. I mean, that was painful. And I just sat them down and I said, I hope you know this hurt me more than it hurt you. You're not feeling it right now, but I can't let you pass this class with this many years. But what can I do to help you get where you need to be?

SPEAKER_01 37:07

Well, and you know, you want to be approachable in those hard times, but also in the successes. Yes. I love um to get, you know, emails from my former students, Dr. Harman, I got this job, or um I'm getting a lot of interesting things now, not just social media requests, but I'm getting save the date. Oh, I'm gonna do that. You know, like I have I love that. Um, and that that's meaningful for me too. It's like why we are doing this, you know, why do we show them the vulnerable parts of our teaching careers? Why do we share with them that I had a professor one time who called me at home? You know, why do we do that? And it's so that we can create them to be productive members of society, yeah. Um, and to, you know, just to change the world um one student at a time, right?

SPEAKER_00 37:50

Absolutely, absolutely. And what a joy to know that we are making that difference in our communities and in our state and beyond.

SPEAKER_01 37:57

Oh, yeah, that's that you are so yes, yes. This has implications for your state. Um, and I think that's that's huge. So thank you. Yes. Well, um, this has uh been just a wonderful, wonderful episode. I couldn't have I couldn't have imagined a better way to kick off insightful teaching. So thank you again.

SPEAKER_00 38:18

Well, and it means the world to me as well, and I really hope that people will take into consideration the value of this job. It's amazing. It's an amazing career, and there's so much little things we can do to give back.

SPEAKER_01 38:33

All right, as we come to a close of the first episode of Insightful Teaching, I find myself reflecting on how powerful relationships are in shaping not only how students learn, but who they become. Um, just as I've told you a little bit about who I've become because of one amazing teacher. Today's conversation has reminded us that motivation doesn't just begin with grades or with a syllabus, it begins with connection, with students feeling seen, valued, and genuinely supported. And that kind of teaching doesn't require perfection, right? Absolutely. Absolutely. It requires presence and intention and care. And care. And care. Again, my personally, this episode uh was just very meaningful sitting across from someone who once stood at the front of my undergraduate classroom at the Wise Center. Um and now joining me truly, I mean this Karen, as a colleague who I haven't told you this, but I really hope we can meet regularly and have coffee and catch up. Uh, this has just been a beautiful reminder that great teaching ripples forward in ways we may never fully see, but at one relationship, one conversation, and one classroom at a time. An audience, that's exactly what my hope for insightful teaching is. And it's why this podcast exists. At the Center for Innovation and Teaching Excellence, our mission is to support you in the work you do, not just with tools and strategies, but with community, inspiration, and space to reflect. As we've talked about today, teaching is complex. It's demanding, and it's deeply human. You are not meant to do this alone. I urge you to think about this next week or next month about this one question. Where might a small moment of connection make a big difference for one of your students? Thank you for joining us for the very first episode of Insightful Teaching. If today's conversation resonated with you, consider sharing it with a colleague. In our upcoming episodes, we'll continue exploring innovative, research-informed, and human-centered approaches to teaching and learning here at Mississippi State and beyond. Until next time, keep teaching with insightful purpose, keep innovating with an insightful heart, and keep being the reason someone believes they belong. Thank you.